TheBogEnd » Tooting are Pathetic

Mikem · 02/1/2018 7:32 pm

Not my words, but those uttered by a lifelong supporter of decades at the Leatherhead game yesterday. However, I must agree with his comments. After a round trip of nearly 6 hours, to witness a game that was dead and buried before half time was an affront to a competitive match. Leatherhead looked an average team, or perhaps they only had to play average against a team that looked totally lost.

The mini attacking line up looked a joke against the towering Tanners defence. Two first half goals conceded from our left defensive flank, which looked weak all game, could have been even more in the second half with the ball constantly flying across the goal mouth and keeper Pierson making some credible saves.

DMG was a huge miss to the team who has provided enthusiasm, mobility and energy for our midfield since his introduction. Totally outplayed in midfield with the Tanners picking up most loose balls made for a frustrating afternoon. When there was an opportunity to put some pressure on the home defence from free kicks or corners, and with our two tall defenders in the opposing box , they were completed wasted, time after time. The net result was nil pressure on Leatherhead but a scramble to get back to defend the breaking Tanners attack, and pile even more pressure on an overwhelmed mid field.

Jake Baxter was totally ineffectual, only when Omar Folkes was introduced did we have a player who could hold the ball up and also make a challenge for headers. Why he started on the bench is beyond me. Isaiah Jones a real young talent tried hard to inject some energy into attacks but was not receiving the service or the opportunities to show his undoubted talent.

Notwithstanding all of the above the Terrors had two great opportunities in the second half. The first one which unbelievably miss by a Tooting player (Baxter, I think? ) standing on the goal line and hitting the cross bar, which Leatherhead scrambled away. The second was a free kick some 25 yards from goal which Wedgeworth struck against the angle of the post and bar. But these were the dismal highlights of game which was out of reach of the Terrors from the first minute.

Poor Dan Clements received a terrible injury to the upper shin/knee area after challenging for the ball, and he had to be assisted from the pitch in great discomfort and pain. Let's hope it's not as serious as it looked?

Lastly, when will Tooting get rid of the disgusting Cadbury's milk tray kit? The lights at Enfield and Leatherhead are of a poor quality, and the away kit does not stand out in these conditions, how many times at Enfield did we see ball given away? This kit is not conducive for floodlit football

I make no apologies for this posting, it's time to face the reality of the situation we are in, or just enjoy the shambles of a terrible season which could have been avoided.

Wilde · 03/1/2018 8:32 am

Shame you feel like this, its non league footie players do try. i hate it when we lose but we must support your team threw thick n thin.,

alanj · 03/1/2018 9:19 am

Could not agree with you more Wilde.
Sometimes expectations exceed reality.
People should take a step back, consider where we are or where we could be.
Someone, or something, is always worse off than you so you should consider yourself lucky.

Bog End Ultra · 03/1/2018 10:38 am

Mikem wrote:
Not my words, but those uttered by a lifelong supporter of decades at the Leatherhead game yesterday.

I can't for the life of me imagine who that might've been......

Bit of an understatement about Leatherhead's floodlights, they were shocking. They were the cause of a witty Bog End song though when a few Tanners fans were making their way towards the exit in front of us, we started chanting.........

" WE CAN'T SEE YOU SNEAKING OUT, WE CAN'T SEE YOU SNEAKING OUT "

Bogend Ant · 03/1/2018 3:01 pm

I like having youth in the side... Dom, Jones and Tope are our 3 best players at the moment... But too much youth is not good... Our u23 side our top of the league I think so some do deserve a chance at first team level... But we need more experience in the team

casey · 03/1/2018 3:31 pm

The thing with our team is we have to play our way through.This is a good thing,but we have to except we will struggle in some games.we will be bullied.we have no enforcers.To early to say but would like to see Ryan James start.The other new signing we haven’t seen yet.Im hopeful that we survive this season,then try and get a balanced squad for next season.I agree we must get these young players on contract.If they go we must get something for them.I hope they stay and grow with Tooting.

Mikem · 03/1/2018 5:10 pm

It's great to see the apologist first to react to my straight assessment of a game which we all had to endure. At least some later postings have come up with some positive comments and not the same old drivel that's been on here week after week.

Now let me address Wilde and Alanj, please explain to me where I have said the team were not trying and why I should be ashamed of myself! ? These maybe non league players but they are paid for their endeavours, unless you play for Corinthian Casuals. I would be shocked if the players did not give their all at Leatherhead. You cannot fault the players who played, but when you remove a couple of vital cogs from the machine the whole thing falls over.

Now please follow up and explain to me which of my comments were not valid.

As I stated after the Dorking game the team would not be good enough in the next league. Look at the squad that finished last season and the squad today, it does not resemble any semblance of that 2016/17 team and is still undergoing changes. These should have started last May not halfway through a season and trying to play catch up. Luckily only one to go down, however we have 20 games to play and 12 of them away, and some teams around us have games in hand.

I keep reading be patient and consider myself lucky. Well my patient has run out, born and bred a Tooting fan I have witnessed the great heights of this club, followed by the declining years. The old members committee which ran a solid and well run club were never replaced with people of the same ability. The 1977/78 season witnessed the gradual down fall of the club when the Terrors lost away to Runcorn in the FA Trophy. The furore in the press after the game went on for weeks we resignations which included on how the club was run. Apart from a couple of blips we have been in a void ever since. Only the presence of Billy Smith and Mark Beard added some excitement to a Ryman Premier team, but only to be torpedoed by the owners. Winning the Sunday League last season was a slight success, only to be confronted with reality this season.

I am sick and tired of reading about budgets be patient etc etc. There seems to be a complete acceptance of being indifferent about the team and let's see what happens. I have yet to read any positive post on how to take this club forward other than a snail's pace. The young and gifted players which have been discovered will not stay around long if we are relegated or indeed struggle to retain our Premiership place. I should imagine clubs are already sending scouts to look at our young players, as witnessed at the game against Merstham. Where do we go then.... or should we be patient!

alanj · 03/1/2018 9:48 pm

Next time Mikem when you accuse people of making statements, check first if what you are saying is correct.
Where did I accuse you of saying " the team were not trying" and where did I state "you should be ashamed of yourself.
Before you start quoting people, check your facts first.

I have better things to do than begin to answer yet another rant regarding the poor quality of the team etc as your thoughts and mine are miles apart . . But what I will say is, show me another supporter who will agree with your comments regarding Mark Beard "adding excitement to our team", Billy Smith yes, but Mark, I don't think so.

Last edited by alanj (03/1/2018 9:49 pm)

Bog End Ultra · 03/1/2018 10:33 pm

59robbery wrote:
We should also remember that the club we all support has never been above this level. Some clubs have left us behind but many more have sunk into oblivion.

BULLSEYE ! In my humble opinion we find ourselves in our natural habitat.

Maybe somebody crawled out of the wrong side of his coffin this morning again.

Keep supporting the team/club fellas get behind them, keep urging them on from behind the goal, be the 12th man, I know the players/staff appreciate it.

WE'RE THE BOG END SANDY LANE

alanj · 04/1/2018 10:07 am

Could not agree more Cricket, and what is wrong with that!.
I came back to this level of football after a very enjoyable time as a season ticket holder at a premiership club, having supported Tooting from the age of thirteen I felt the need to return to get my football fix when I gave up my season ticket.
Initially the type of football and the skill level came as a bit of a surprise but once I adjusted my expectancy levels, I soon came to realise this is what football should be all about, not just turning up at a game surrounded by people you did not know, or in some cases had no wish to know, but turning up to meet either in the bar or at the game and meeting like minded people with like minded views, the majority of whom came from the same area as yourself, unlike most premiership clubs where they could have come from half way round the world.
In hindsight I wish I had not spent my time following the team I always supported from the age of six, but had spent these years doing what I do now, both home and away and so getting the full experience and at tremendous value.

endofthelane · 04/1/2018 12:22 pm

The thing is, we all want our team to win every game and to be successful every season. But the reality of supporting a team is that you will lose as many as you win (if you're lucky) and that you will also see awful games and disastrous seasons. And almost every team will suffer relegations from time to time.

Hopefully, the experience of supporting a team isn't solely related to the result on a Saturday afternoon. It should be a lot more than that. And you just have to take the rough with the smooth. Its the bad times that make the good times taste so much better!

Bog End Ultra · 04/1/2018 12:35 pm

Yeah, but if we won every game from now til Doomsday some people would moan about the price of Fairy Liquid or the Christmas TV schedule.........it's what they do.

I've had an almost identical football watching experience to yourself Ashtree....except I don't regret the seasons I spent following the only London team to have ever been crowned 'Champions of Europe' partly due to the fact I didn't have to travel 2,000 miles to see every home game

Wilde · 04/1/2018 1:55 pm

we all like a moan and you can,t please all the people all the time, following a team is tough but I theirs a lot of hard work goes into any club I without them we can,t follow a team we love come win or lose,

alanj · 04/1/2018 3:08 pm

I am not sure whether you would agree with me Cricket, but I think the WHOLE experience of watching non league football, far superior to that of watching the premiership.
As much as I love Manchester United, and always will do, I do regret the time spent driving up and down the country to watch a match in order to get my fix, when what I wanted, and now enjoy to it's fullest, was right on my doorstep.
Perhaps I have just become, over the years, very disgruntled with the attitude shown by these overpaid prima donnas when compared to their non league counterparts.
No for me, it`s non league every time, as Endo rightly states, you never know what you are going to experience and while the result is not secondary, it is not what it is all about.
Roll on Saturday

Bog End Ultra · 04/1/2018 3:58 pm

alanj wrote:
I am not sure whether you would agree with me Cricket, but I think the WHOLE experience of watching non league football, far superior to that of watching the premiership.

100% Ashtree, 100%

Mikem · 04/1/2018 4:09 pm

I am responding to the crap that has been written on here about my views on the Leatherhead game which have been twisted out of all context to what was originally posted. After travelling nearly 6 hours I am entitled to publish my views on this awful game. There has not been one valid response comment on my match posting, although have been contacted with support for my comments on the game, and from some surprising sources. There are far more people who read this forum than post.

AJ - Wilde indicated my posting inferred the players were not trying, and it was a shame I felt this way. As usual you jump in with both feet and agreed with Wilde's comments. You and your cronies seem to think this forum is your fiefdom! As for wasting your time on here responding to me is laughable. You seem to get involved with every topic on here, which is an amusement to many. You have now idiots posting on here about winning every game, where have I stated this? I have the guts to post my own views and I will continue to do so.

Instead of you meandering off subject, I am still waiting for your response on my views on the Leatherhead game with baited breath ....I don't think.

59er - you posted a polite response, and will try really hard to be polite in my response. I don't wear rose tinted glasses, I am really have fond memories of our glory years, sadly the current fan base will not be able to look forward to glory times unless there is titanic turn around on how the Team progress. Without an history there in not a team, without a future there is not a team. My glasses have the word reality imprinted on both lenses.

You quote " the club we support has never been above this level." When Tooting joined the Isthmian league 61 years ago it was considered the number 1 league in the country. When amateurism was abolished and the non league pyramid now fully operational , the team now play in level 3, and last season in level 4.

Mark Beard was starting to form the nucleus of a good team and rebuilding after the sad departure of Billy Smith. This was undone by the arrival of Ronnie and Reggie who insisted Beard played a bunch of useless players they had recruited. I went to a match at Concord Rangers when the team were 6th in the premier league, except for one player Beard played his own team. Shortly afterwards Beard either walked or was sacked. The net result after only a short few months the Team were swept down the gutter into the drains and finally into the sewer, with the most shambolic and embarrassing episode of the 130 years of the club's history. The damage is still undergoing repair today, but the hardcore fans voted with their feet have never been replaced.

I will be posting in 5 years time, especially when I have to waste time and money watching the crap witnessed at Leatherhead.

Ultra - Firstly if I did get out of the wrong side of my Coffin, my postings would have to be deleted and the forum closed down. I am also a fanatical fan, unfortunately not many of us left! I find some of your comments very amusing, and at other times quite pointless. There is no doubt the Bog End crowd had a great influence at Tonbridge and at Enfield when the team deserved to win. Similar support is required this Saturday for this crucial game. This is not only a double pointer but will have a morale impact on the team if they play the same as they did at Leatherhead

dac123 · 04/1/2018 7:24 pm

This might be a controversial view but, at what point do you decide it isn't worth the unhappiness?

I'd never advocate losing a lifelong fan, but such deep unhappiness can't be good for anyone! You only live once...

Last edited by dac123 (04/1/2018 7:24 pm)

Bogend Ant · 04/1/2018 9:22 pm

Have a look at the Kingstonion forum... There having a similar debate about them... Intrestingly they recond they could go down this year...

Bogend Ant · 04/1/2018 9:25 pm

Its worth pointing out that this club has a great history... If im right in saying the Ishmian league was basicly the same leval as the Confrence is now before the Conference was made when we joined the Ishmian...

Mikem · 05/1/2018 1:37 pm

59er- This my last posting on the original topic which has seemed to be hijacked by postings which have zero relevance to my posting.

I must congratulate you on being the first person to make an actual comment on the actual content of my first postings. I disagree with part of your statement, but I will leave it at that.

After the war and until the mid sixties the Isthmian League was considered the strongest Non league in the Country by the press and in general. A handful of Northern clubs were successful in the Amateur Cup notably Bishop Auckland. But the Isthmian League had far greater depth and quality in terms of the competing teams, as well as Attendances and stadiums etc. It was a great leap forward for the Terrors when they were elected in 1956. In fact if you look at the League that season only Tooting, St Albans and Corinthian Casuals (although they had played in the final )had not won the Amateur Cup. But this is all irrelevant as times have changed drastically.

Let's face it after the Beard debacle the Team could not sink any lower, even you and I could have produced an improvement and that's saying something. The Team is now approaching what Mark Beard created but still needs lots of improvement.

Lastly, I don't really care if people agree with me or not. If I pay to watch game, and players and management are paid, I have the full right to voice my opinion. But what I do care about is individuals who seize on something and twisted to their own end. I have noticed anyone else who dares post something negative about the team it's always the same group who gang up on the originator.

The End

endofthelane · 05/1/2018 2:46 pm

As a little bit of background to which level we've played at, before the formation of the Conference, there were 3 leagues of approximately equal standing: Northern, Southern and Isthmian. Possibly the Isthmian was considered the junior partner, but there was nothing official. However, when the conference was formed, it only consisted of Northern and Southern League teams. I don't know why this was the case. However, in the 3rd season of the conference, 2 Isthmian League teams joined (Enfield and Dagenham). Enfield did particularly well finishing 2nd and 1st in their first 2 seasons, suggesting that the Isthmian was of fairly equal standard back then.

Incidentally, Enfield and Dagenham didn't earn promotion via league position (Dagenham finished 7th in the Isthmian League the season before. Again, I don't know why this was the case, but presumably Tooting had the opportunity to apply for the conference as we finished 12th that season.

Whatever the reasons, the Isthmian League effectively became the 2nd tier of non league fromthe 1979-80 season, and hence we found ourselves at that level until we were relegated at the end of 1989. We have not been at level 2 since. We spent 8 years at level 3 before the disastrous relegation to Isthmian 2nd division in 1997, thereby playing at level 4 for the 1st time. We got promoted back to level 3 under Keith Boanas in 2001, but slipped back to level 4 following the introduction of the Conference North and South in 2004-05. So we had another 4 seasons at level 4 until the promotion under Billy Smith in 2008. Then 4 more seasons at level 3 until the relegation under Ronnie & Reggie. It took 5 years before Frank Wilson led us to promotion, back to level 3 where we are today.

So in summary, we have spent the last 29 seasons yoyoing between level 3 and level 4 of the non-league pyramid. (16 years at level 3 and 13 years at level 4) 1989 was the last time we were at level 2 (which is the level of the conference south now.) I struggle to envisage us as a conference side, but I don't see any reason why we shouldn't set our medium to long term sights on the conference south. But unfortunately, you have to accept that we are now a level 3/4 club, when 40 years ago we were a level 1 club. Like I say, I don't see those days returning.

Last edited by endofthelane (05/1/2018 2:48 pm)

Bogend Ant · 05/1/2018 6:22 pm

This club has a Conference South or Confrence Prem standerd history ( If you know what I mean) And the same standard Ground and Facilities... The only thing we would need to improve is crowds...

Bondy · 06/1/2018 12:43 am

Oh dear Mike.
Firstly to your match report on the Leatherhead game.
Quite right, blooming miserable performance to watch. And it was cold.

Without Mike D, Dom, Dines etc we looked toothless against a bunch of large and knarly, experienced old pros.
We got rid of Cummingham but the return of Baxter again places the emphasis on delivery to the front. Lumping the ball up to him will just not work.
I understand Omar has not been completely well for some weeks, hence his limited game time.

Dan is only a little lad but to me (and I was very, very close) he went in to a 50/50 challenge half heartedly and suffered the consequences. Obviously I wish him well as you do. Good player. Nice lad. Scores good goals.

What you will have surely gathered from the postings above of our little gang (I assume you consider me a prize member) is that they/we actually enjoy the many and varied twists and turns of supporting a non league side.
Being depressed most of the time, and sharing that depression with a bunch of like minded lunatics, is actually part of the fun. And it makes those occasions when you do have a bit of success (a cup run, an away victory, avoiding relegation or, glory be, a promotion!) all that more enjoyable.
And certainly far, far better than being herded from a station under police protection to be corralled together to watch a Premier League game at huge expense.
Or not being able to afford a ticket to see your team and basing your footie spouting on multiple MOTD replays. Plenty of those about eh.

Of course your gang on the dark and gloomy side are fully entitled to pay their money and then post on here what they like.
But what our gang don’t understand is: If you are committed enough to follow your team but you never, ever seem to actually enjoy it then.......why bother? Simply stop coming and be happy.

‘But T&M is my club’ I hear you say in high dudgeon.
Well then just get on and support your team, cheer them on loudly at every game you attend and enjoy the good times that- and bad.
Personally, as frustrating as things continue to be, I would much rather watch us struggling to find our feet back in the Premier Division in the hope things will settle down and perhaps even improve than watch us winning every week in the dire standard of South.
I wonder if you agree?

Routemaster · 06/1/2018 11:09 am

Come on chaps, let's not argue, bicker and throw insults at each over. We all support the same team, want the team to do well and ultimately win and succeed, in this case to avoid relegation. Most persons on here have been supporting the terrors for a lot longer than myself and from the way certain entry's are written there clearly is pride and passion for this club. But surely there is an improvement from five years ago, but yes it hasn't quite gone to plan or expectation this season. If you look at the three other teams promoted from last season, they are not a huge distance away from as so we are all struggling to settle in this better league. It would have been nice to have signed a couple more players with experience at this league, but the budget probably can't stretch to this, saying that, I don't believe we have the lowest budget in the league. What we need to do though is unite, get behind the team and hopefully we will survive this season and make progress for next season. We will have our ups and downs, but like Huddersfield Town in premiership, you will get destroyed by the better teams, but if you can challenge with the lesser teams, who knows.

Bondy · 06/1/2018 11:40 am

Nobody is throwing insults Routey. Just exchanging differing opinions on our Forum.